One thing

In the last couple of days, I've been reading a bit more about the thoughts of the people around me and well, browsing the net and so. I've found that forum wise many people say 'Big Boards usually have the default theme of <insert forum software>, I don't need a custom design'. You do not know how much I understand that designing and looking good is not everything. YES, Big Boards success because of the content. But it seems designers will be out of job soon, because Big Boards are successful and need no custom skin. You know, if this mind set was the most dominating, graphic designers, uniqueness online wouldn't have been created, let's go back to HTML pages with no CSS, no JQuery, no Ajax, no nothing, just plain HTML. Would you deny that a really good skin and really good content interests you? Wouldn't it make it a bit more pleasant when the site looks good? More importantly, wouldn't that attract a more modern audience for more diversity?

Our forums, our sites are made because we are hobbyists and we want to share with hobbyists alike. Which means the content has to be something that grasps the audience. I've always said, design is like the 'first impression' of the web. Design isn't everything, but it's the first thing your users see when entering the site, therefore it's everything in some cases.

/end rant

 

Design is incredibly important. I pay my designers more a year than anyone else to keep the site fresh looking. Design sets your site apart from others in your niche. While content is king, it will not get found when it is wrapped in poor design.

 

I've been saying this for years and I 100% agree with you. This isn't a rant though FMB, it's prity much common sense and one aspect of the trade shouldn't take priority over the other or neglected, frowned upon or whatever. I'm referring to code and graphic design. Alot of people have got into the mind set that because they code, this is the only area of a site that's important when it's not. And before the old age argument comes in saying graphic intensive sites drives people away then I'll say that a visually pleasing site/forum etc doesn't need to be graphically intensive to be visually appealing. Good ole colour coordination and usage implementation is key.

 

i think design is important, cause if all forums looked the same, and just had the default skin, they would be boring. being unique is important, cause it makes things look more interesting! also the design of a forum can be more appealing to some audiences. for example if the forum was aimed at teenagers, they might find a more colourful background more appealing than just the plain looking default skin.

 

@ Shelley: OMG exactly!!! People keep saying 'I don't want my sites to be filled with graphics' when that's why Minimalist designs exist! You could make a site look good with little graphics, you don't need ovar nine thousands images. I've noticed that usually when people think of web design they quickly think 'overflowed with graphics'.

 

The best style I ever did see was at spacebuffs.com and this was some style (he's since sold it and I think it's offline nowadays) but wow. The styles this guy created were not only brilliant in colour usage, but most areas where minimalistic and loading times instant. I forgot the guys name but he knew how to implement colouring on a scale I rarely see nowadays.

Personally, I'll slice the hell out of my graphic styles (for my own reasons). I don't accommodate dialup so I am at the thinking that a little graphic intensive is warranted considering more and more people have high speed broadband.

I won't mention the time I designed and coded up a usergroup legend which had rollover effects and consisted of over a 150 slices.

 

Yep yep I agree with FMB and Shelley. Couldn't have said it better.

 

Of course design is important. Many people who assume that the use of big sites using default or bad design is relevant fail to realise something quite simple... well, two things:

1. Many of these sites were around when forums themselves were a new gimmick, or have enough content the design doesn't matter.

2. Many sites became successful IN SPITE OF bad design, not because of it.

Heck, many big boards would probably get MORE traffic, not less if they had a better design.

 

So....not to change direction here, b/c I do agree with what is said even though I can't design worth sh@t, how does a Nut like me go about coming up with a design?

As in how would you buttered up designers need to be approached. Talk to me (others) like I'm a n00b. Why?

B/c I've got a rant that is well, I can't seem to find a cookbook on how to go about developing a design, submitting one, etc.!!! yes, i've looked at so many sites, I've gathered or noted what I like, I've dabbled with that is available to me, but then I don't know the next step other that to request stuff from people.

The design is impeccably importante!! (see my espanol?) I use it to gauge my interest in concert with the content.

I see other sites that offer a Price. But that price is for something that still remains in the realm of creativity. As a potential buyer...how do i know I'm not being ripped? How do I know I've got something...that is a design and not trash?

I didn't mean to be ranty on your rant. If Nick would like to break this out to a new thread or have me redo it, I certainly will, but thought it was just the next step on your rant, which is qualifying that Designers are needed and more so, how to make the communication back to the requester of a design be successful.

 

I always hope a person comes to me with something other than 'like this site' and come up with their actual DREAM of their site.

You have the ideas, you need to learn the tools. As I've said many times, I am product of wanting to learn and get better. Two years ago I knew nothing about the online world, and I was always amazed at some sites because they always look well made for me. Perseverance and desire is everything! If you want to learn, you can. Keep in mind that not quickly after you have 'known' photoshop, or any design program you use, you won't be a master, your thoughts, your 'creativeness' won't be conveyed as quickly, you need to keep practicing until you're able and you're satisfy with the end product. Never give up, if you don't get your image exactly, try again. Practice DOES make perfect. Designing is not easy, but with the right amount of desire, you can achieve anything. Believe me.

As I said above, the next step would be learning the software both photoshop and the software you want to design, wether forum, CMS, blogging or e-commerce. There is no cookbooks, but people who show you their style. There are many ways to achieve one thing on every program, it's to find the way you're more comfortable in. I never looked at one tut, I couldn't, too boring. Trial and error. You will develop your own style once you get the hang of it, of course you will explore many other ways, grunge, retro, gaming, etc. Keeping up with the trends online, or bring real life trends into the online world.

Inspiration comes from everywhere, all you six senses help. Maybe you love how peaceful the ocean is, how graphical a game is, or how dirty rust looks.

You really don't. Usually designers have a portfolio and their own site, it will show you the quality of their designs. If they don't have a portfolio, ask them for examples of their work.

 

Are you plugged into my head? I've said this many times to people asking the same question. Not in those exact words mind, but very close.

@MjrNuTI'll elaborate on this further on the tools. Learn the tools, and when i say tools I mean the default tools for the program you are wanting to use. Forget using filters and 3rd party plugins that give you an instant effect with one click of a button because you'll learn absolutely nothing from it. The amount of designers that hire me out weighs the people who know nothing about graphic designs because all they've ever done was create siggies from 3rd party effect filters. Learn the tools, familiarize yourself with each one and what it can do then take baby steps in creating something simple and pace yourself progressively which each day that passes. For me I learned photoshop from experimenting, trial and error, alot of error. But it has got to the point nowadays where I can think up a design and know exactly what tools and features I'll use before my designs even migrate to the computer.

Plus everything fmb said is very sound advice.

 

girls....girls...girls. (said w/ fondness)

I'm not at all interested in learning to design. I'm wanting to know how do I approach, submit, interact, screen, for getting a designer to do my bidding.

I have plenty of other things that take up my time...and I assure you from what I've tried, you don't want to see it. Well, you saw my feeble attempt at a Chinchilla a couple months ago.

e.g., Every service has some "standard" product. People start with that standard product and then have the choice to add to it. In this sense of forums design for simplistic discussion....do each of you when taking on a contract for a design establish a Price $X for Y number of images, color schemes, effects, icons, etc.?

Idk if that made sense right thar...I need to compose my thoughts more coherently...that damn chinchilla just made me cackle lol

 

I never seen your chinchilla I tell you what you show me your chinchilla and I'll show you my rat (on steroids). lol

 

@Shelley -- You skirt (double usage, noun and verb)


roid kill ppl. :rofl:

 

NO comment on the chinchilla, I has no rat, I have a hamster.

At least in my point of view, I love when a person comes up to me wanting a design and knowing EXACTLY what they want. I am not every designer out there, but I might speak for some. At least in my case (and some others), they will charge you based upon the complexity of the design, how many hours they will take is usually the approach many designers use for when they make a design, forum software also takes a toll on the price. vB skins are way more pricey than MyBB skins, it's based on the population that uses the software.

The way you interact with the designer will be decided in the 'first impression' of the person. I'm pretty sure that's why if I want to get into learning design I have to go through that BORING communications class. If you do chose the designer, feedback is very important. I love hearing feedback and what I can improve on, that'll make me work harder. No one likes negative feedback, but we have to take it(sometimes it can go a bit too much), you're the customer and we're designing YOUR site. IMO if you want custom work done to your site/forum, you need to see how unique is the portfolio of the designer, how does each of his word set apart. How many techniques does he/she use, how do their own site look like.

As for the colors and stuff, a really good designer will give you feedback on color choices and will brainstorm with you to see what he can achieve from your dream site. Many designers will have VERY different ways to make your 'dream' come true, after all, we have our own style.

Communication will depend of both sides, more of the client to give feedback on the design to see what they would like changed. Time will depend on how 'popular' or busy this designer is, he/she might have a busy schedule because of work, school or he/she has a family to attend to or that real life shizz, or maybe he/she has a lot of requests. Support, you have to ask the designer that when you first speak to him/her. When you meet the designer have a set of questions to ask that mean a lot to you. 'How often will I be able to give feedback on my design?', 'How long after you've done the design will you support it?' 'What price would it be for a site that has <insert feature, custom logo, buttons, icons and the layout like <insert style>?'. Designers will have(SOME) a page set up with basic prices, where they start and they 'might' not have an ending price.

My :2cents:

 

Okay do we have a slap face smiley. lol

*gives herself the 100 slap a sec treatment*